Posted by Robert Dilley on September 28, 2003 at 16:14:15 from 216.211.4.77 user rdilley.
In Reply to: Re: - Cumberland; wholesale removal posted by Peter H on September 28, 2003 at 13:45:03:
To continue the pedantry (because it's fun) -- "Cumbria" was historically the generic name for the NW corner of England, including the Lake District. It derives from the Celtic settlement of the area, as does the Welsh Cymru (pronounced more-or-less "Cumry") which is the local term for Wales.
The division of Cumbria arose from waves of incoming settlers -- the Scots held the northern parts for quite a while (in Macbeth Duncan makes his elder son Prince of Cumberland; the counterpart to Prince of Wales). The Anglo-Saxons moved in from the east, and the Norse circled around Scotland to occupy Ireland, the Isle of Man and Cumbria (especially the dales) -- also Pembrokeshire in Wales.
In popular history the last "King of Cumbria" was Dumnal or Dunmail; purportedly buried by his warriors under the huge cairn at the summit of Dunmail Raise, and his crown hidden in Grisedale Tarn, after defeat against the invading Anglo-Saxons. In fact, Dunmail was a grade-A chicken, who fled before the invaders and lived out a comfortable life in Rome. As discussed on this site before (War of 1812) legend rarely pays much attention to fact. The area was then divided between the different groups of invaders.
As for accent, Peter H is correct to a point. There is certainly no uniform "Cumbrian" accent; but neither is there a single "Cumberland", "Westmorland" or "Lancashire" accent. Each part of the area has its own peculiarities. We have friends who visit us regularly from Carlisle, and their accent is quite distinct from that of West Cumberland (Workington, Whitehaven etc) which again is recognisably different from that of the Pennine villages and the villages in the high Lake District fells. AR would have been most familiar with the upper Furness accent of the Coniston area (which would not have been the same as that from Barrow and from Stan Laurel's home town of Ulverston) and the Westmerian accent of the Windermere area (oddly, all of Windermere was in Westmorland, while 3/4 of its shoreline was in Lancashire).
A final, ultra-pedantic point: when the administrative county of Cumbria was created in (quite right, Peter) 1974 it incorporated all of Cumberland, Westmorland, the Furness district of Lancashire and a part of Yorkshire (notably Sedbergh).
As for reading out loud -- I did so to my family for some 20 years, and I always prided myself in trying to be authentic with local accents. AR made it especially easy, as his depiction of accent (except for Chinese) was so precise. I like to try out different accents when I travel, though my wife tried to shush me in Kentucky, as she was sure the locals would think I was taking the mickey. Y'all thank so?